Interview with Natasha Halliday, Therapist, Emerging Resilient Counselling and Psychotherapy, Canada

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INTERVIEW HIGHLIGHTS:

• What affects youth’s mental health, and what are just human emotions.
• How to assist a child when concerned about their mental health
• How to connect to youth
• How to gain insights into issues affecting other cultures
• How to contribute so you don’t suffer from compassion fatigue

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Interview with Natasha Halliday, Therapist, Emerging Resilient Counselling and Psychotherapy; Canada

Natasha Halliday is a therapist, speaker and comedian. Natasha believes that we all possess resilience. Natasha has worked supporting individuals with their mental health for over 20 years. She is dedicated to uncovering the resilience already there, fostering and building resilience where needed, and demonstrating how to grow through adversity. She is passionate about helping people move past fear into the life they desire and are purposed to live. Natasha infuses humor into most aspects of her life, a skill she learned growing up in a very funny family. Natasha is a published author and was recently part of a collaborative project called Affirmations For a Woman on a Mission Journal.

United Nation’s Sustainable Development Goal(s) addressed:
#3. Good Health and Well-being, #10. Reduced Inequalities

Social impact:
Working as a speaker, therapist and comedian, Natasha is part of people's healing journey. She believes we all need help with something at some time. Although she works with all ages, her heart is with youth. Where mood, mental wellness, resilience, unmasking fear, mindset and humour are concerned, Natasha employs her expertise to educate, encourage, and brighten one's perspective. Natasha also supports several causes.

Website: http://www.natashahalliday.com

Interview with Natasha Halliday, Therapist, Emerging Resilient Counselling and Psychotherapy

Note: This interview is transcribed using AI software, which means, the transcription is not perfect. Watch the video or listen to the podcast to hear our guest’s wisdom in her own words. If you want to see more interviews like this, please comment below!

[00:00:00] YouMeWe: Welcome to the YouMeWe Amplified Podcast interviews with women leading social impact, hosted by Suzanne F Stevens, international speaker, author, and multi-award-winning social entrepreneur and founder of the YouMeWe we social Impact Group. Enjoy the wisdom that will be a compass on how to make your contribution count for you, your organization and your community.

[00:00:21] Suzanne F. Stevens: Welcome to you. Me, we Amplified Podcast. I’m Suzanne F. Stevens. Your host. Welcome to those joining us live or watching the recording. This episode is sponsored by the YouMeWe community women, leading social impact. If you have a social impact and you want to grow it, grow you or grow your business, visit the community tab at youmewe.ca.

Oh, I’m so excited for our guests today. Welcome to our guest, Natasha Halliday, a therapist, speaker, and comedian. No, she’s not going to do comedy today. You never know. Natasha has worked supporting individuals with their mental health for over 20 years, although she works with all ages, her heart is with you. Then we’re going to tap into that a lot today.

Natasha employs, her expertise to educate, encourage, and brighten one’s perspective. Coming to you from Toronto, Ontario, Canada. Let’s welcome, Natasha. Nice to see you, Natasha.

[00:01:18] Natasha Halliday: Good to see you. Thank you for having me.

[00:01:20] Suzanne F. Stevens: We’re going to dive right into it today. My first question always is, is, cause I’m always curious of why we do what we do.

So, what was the catalyst for you to decide, to become a therapist?

[00:01:32] Natasha Halliday: So, what’s so funny about me doing the work that I do, is I knew always like from like seven, I want to tell people, so at seven it was like, I’m going to be a lawyer or a psychologist. Why? I already knew this at seven God and knows, and by about, high school, it was like, oh, it requires a lot of reading.

Do I want to read about the law, or do I want to read about the human mind? So, I started moving towards psychology. One of my big sisters was a psychology major. Part of it was just kind of wanting to do what my big sister did. I started out as a psych major.

And then transitioned to a college program called child and youth work. And I was living away. I was living in Ottawa doing school and I called home and I said, this program was designed for me. And it was just like, it was the most perfect fit. I was like everything about this program, screams to who I am.

And it just. It’s always just been synchronous. I love youth. I love all people. But I just love youth. And as I get further away from youth, it keeps me youthful working with them. So, um, it’s just really been, um, Like a transition. I worked in hospitals doing acute care. But again, it was always about being involved with people with mental health concerns.

And my goal is just to be part of their journey to move toward healing. Anywhere I can be a part of that journey, I’m happy to be a part of it. I more recently transitioned to working solely for myself and doing the therapy, full-time aside from the speaking. And the little bit of comedy.

 It was an evolving process just looking at how can I be involved in helping people, especially young people. And that’s kind of how I, where I started and how I kind of got to where I am now.

[00:03:17] Suzanne F. Stevens: Now you mentioned something about when you were studying this, you knew it was for you. What specifically was it that you were learning that connected to you?

Well, like I left psychology initially because in supposedly doing all my due diligence research, I went to a school that had psych arts and psych science. And I chose the one that was leading toward research and I wanted to work directly with people. So, I said, okay, I’ve got to pivot. And I already knew about the child and youth work program.

And when I entered it, it was one of the things about child and youth care specifically is a relational approach. And so, while you’re applying theories and different scientific, practical, things. It’s also about how can you help people through relationship? And that’s what really hit home for me. And I think allows me to work really authentically because I’m not so in my mind about therapeutic modalities. I’m present in relationship and I’m intertwining those therapeutic modalities as part of the relationship to help people with their concerns. So that really is I think the heart of why I loved it so much.

Now, before we dive deeper into the therapy, I have to ask, do you include comedy at all in your practice?

[00:04:35] Natasha Halliday: So I’ve been doing comedy for just over two years, about two and a half. So I always in intertwined humor, but I knew that part of the reason I could do that was because of relationships. Because I had to be able to assess, is this going to be helpful or harmful? Because you don’t want to come across as making fun of you don’t want to come across as belittling someone’s issue.

 And so I often directed the humor toward myself. And gave them an opportunity to laugh at me in order to, one lighten the mood sometimes, and two just see that even in the midst of dealing with painful things, we don’t have to exclude laughter. I really live my life by trying to laugh every day of my life.

And so I hopefully can teach people to do a bit of the same and just have that. If life is rough, have that moment of reprieve where you can smile, where you can laugh and you can just, breathe through that laughter. Well, I don’t think I formally do it, I don’t think I can avoid doing it because it’s such a part of who I am. And now I’m trying to make it more intentional in my speaking, how do I bring in that aspect of what I do, another part of me, into my speaking as well..

[00:05:43] Suzanne F. Stevens: Yes. Because there is laugh therapy. Right? It’s so true, what an impact it has. I, I, you know, even just talking to you about it reminds me to okay, just laugh at it more.

Because these are things we can’t control. So, we might as well laugh.

[00:06:10] Natasha Halliday: Absolutely.

[00:06:12] Suzanne F. Stevens: What is it specifically that draws you to youth and are they any different in therapy when you’re dealing with youth, then when you’re dealing with adults, is your approach any different?

[00:06:25] Natasha Halliday: There’s not a huge difference in my approach. I think one of the things that I like about working with youth is that ideally there’s so much life ahead. And so, I enjoy being part of that earlier stage. Being able to help someone. But I think maybe the other difference that I find in working with youth is I feel like I get to be more playful. I do with adults where I can assess that that will work. But with youth, I feel like I get to do it more often. And one of the things that I’ve seen is, you learn stuff in school, but role modeling once you build that trust. When I’m honest with young people about the fact that yeah, I have a bunch of degrees on my wall but I started university, went to college, finished college, went back to university years later, went back years later. So, my master’s degree is from 2018, but I graduated from college in 2000. So, it took me quite some time to go from having, a diploma to having a master’s degree. And so when they hear that, they’re like, oh, I just assumed you had it from the get-go.

And I’m like, no, my, my, my journey was all over the place, but it’s still possible. And I love being able to inspire young people to say, yeah, there were bumps in the road. There were things that happened that weren’t great. Like I, when I dropped out of a university realizing it was the wrong one, I was very grateful I had a 400 kilometer distance between me and my parents which made the phone call a lot easier to make they couldn’t hop in their car and be there in a few minutes and say, let’s sit down and talk about this. There’s something about young people that I think energizes me and the more that I work with them. The more that I just, I feel like I learned things that I can bring to that age group that I really love. My last full-time job. I worked in a program that was with transitional-age youth, so 18 to 24. And I think that’s like the heart of what I love to do. You give me like 16 to about 26 and that’s my, my kind of range that I would love to work with. When they’re ending high school, starting college, starting university, or in college and university starting their careers.

Love. Dealing with those transitions of life. I really enjoy supporting young people through those parts of their life.

[00:08:37] Suzanne F. Stevens: So, let’s dive into that. What are some of the mental health issues that, those age groups actually have? If you had to say the top three things that tend to come to our mind.

[00:08:47] Natasha Halliday: Well, I think even like adults, anxiety, depression are the highest. Sometimes the reason for it might be a bit different. But one of the things that I’ve seen absolutely consistently with my young peoples that I now bring to them before they bring it up, is a pressure to figure it all out. By 16, they think they have to figure it all out.

And I’m like, what is it? I’m a lot further from 16 than I was many years ago and it is changing. And so, I’m always figuring it out. And I’ve accepted that, but I find that young people just have this tremendous pressure. And I was chatting with someone yesterday, as we were going for a hike. We don’t realize as adults, how we reinforce this, by the time they hit a certain age, have you decided what you want to do for a living?

What school are you going to have applied to school? Have you gotten into school? All of these different things reinforce this concept of you have to know, but. Nobody exactly knows. And I like to use GPS analogies. So, I give the analogy of if I set my GPS to a destination. So, let’s say I want to go to the Eaton center in Toronto.

I set the GPS. I drive there in my car. I don’t buy camping gear and move. It’s a spot that I wanted to get to, but ideally, I’m going to go somewhere else. And I try to equate that to the idea of figuring it all out. Even when you reach your goal, then you set new goals. And so, there’s never one place that you’re going to settle in.

And so, trying to, include flexibility into the concept of we’re moving through life so that we’re not so rigid that there’s this tremendous stress to always know what we’re supposed to be doing. Always comes up with young people. So I bring it up sometimes before they do.

[00:10:33] Suzanne F. Stevens: Yeah. And you know, I love what you’re saying about “it”.

What is that place right? Is what is it. And a lot of times people will talk about it as being purpose, meaning that, that place of happiness, fulfillment.

Andres, thanks for joining us. Young people aren’t jaded. And they remind me of how we need to look through the world through those eyes.

I don’t know what age Anders is talking about. Uh, they do start to get jaded though, when you’re dealing with them from 16 to 26, do they not?

[00:11:05] Natasha Halliday: Sometimes, a lot of it becomes environmental, right? And so, if everybody around you is jaded, it’s hard not to be jaded. And it’s how we intake information and what we are exposed to.

So, what I try to stress to all my clients of any age, is that we have to remember ingestion is not just through the mouth, it’s through the eyes and the ears. So we’d live in an age where we’re constantly ingesting media. What are we ingesting? Is it giving us indigestion? And I think we can become jaded because we look from this false filter based on media that gives us these concepts. And we forget to decide on our own, what do we want? It influences so much how we see things. And I’m really trying to remind the young people that I work with that one, let’s be honest. I’m the first one to admit, I might post a picture and people like, oh my God, you look great.

Yeah. That was 40 shots in. Let’s tell the truth. Right? It’s we’re not necessarily posting our less glamorous moments. We are posting the things that make us look good. So, try not to look at it and think that’s the, that encompasses somebody’s whole life. You, develop emotions about your own cause you feel you’re not arriving.

Right. And we can be intentional to ingest things that bring us hope that bring us away from being jaded. So, it’s remembering, that we can be intentional about how we take in a lot of these things. I find is something that I often need to remind the young people that I work with.

[00:12:32] Suzanne F. Stevens: Excellent. Now from a parent’s perspective, excuse me, or Guardian’s perspective, what should they be looking out for, with children to see if they are suffering from mental health?

What should they be looking for? And then what should they do?

[00:12:50] Natasha Halliday: So, funny enough, I find this a bit loaded because when somebody is in the adolescent age, between the development of gray matter and hormones and all this stuff, some of what might look like mental health and other areas is just a normal part of being a teenager.

Part of, I think, what becomes, how you look at it is what do you know about your child, about the child that you’re caring for? Drastic differences in who and how they present could be a key sign that something’s different. So, if they’re, all of a sudden, really quiet and that continues for a lengthy period of time.

 We live in a world where we get a bit anxious, I think, fairly easily. So, a day or two change does not mean you need to pathologize and diagnose. And we have to remember to also contextualize. I worked in a program where every time there was something, a little off, I had a mom calling me and I had to talk to her about it. It was her anxiety because I’m like he was upset.

But when I talked to him, he had a fight with a friend. Well, that’s a natural reaction. And that’s an appropriate reaction. If he stays in that space for two to three weeks, we might be concerned, but don’t think that his depression has gotten worse when he’s expressing normal human emotion. And I find that there’s less room, to be honest in our human emotion nowadays.

But in terms of a parent looking at their child, are there things that are significantly different? Is there eating significantly different? Is their sleeping significantly different? Motivation to do things, their functioning in school. And start with as best you can, a dialogue with them. And monitor it for a period of time.

We don’t necessarily need to in the first day or two, then rushed to the doctor. Because I used to work as a crisis worker in the emergency department and I would get families who’d bring their kids in and we’re like, by the time we did the follow-up, everything was fine because it was situated. So, we have to balance situational versus what is a pervasive change that is likely indicating something is not, is not wrong, but something’s different enough that it needs to be looked at and addressed. And asking them questions.

We must give them credit to be able to say, I may not know what’s wrong, but yes, I know something’s different about me. Yes. I know that my emotions are presenting differently and ask them if they’re concerned about it. I know it becomes challenging because the last thing someone’s young people want to do is talk to their parents but try to keep that open dialogue.

So, if something looks different, you, you have that opportunity to have a chat or, you know, engage the auntie who they really like, or the uncle they really like, or, you know, your friend whom they get along with well. Try to have somebody, have that dialogue and part of what’s great about that is they understand that you see what’s going on with them.

And that you’re concerned because that also gives room for, I may not be ready to talk about it now, but maybe in two weeks, when I feel ready to talk about it, I already know that you see that something’s different. One of the hard things about having these dialogues is, that we say what’s wrong? And when the young person knows something’s different, but can’t articulate why or what it becomes frustrating.

And so, it’s more the opening up the I see a difference. Can we talk about it versus is something wrong with you?

[00:16:08] Suzanne F. Stevens: Let’s say someone wants counseling or they need counseling? But they can’t afford it. Are you affiliated with any organizations where there’s sort of a payment plan or sponsorship program for counseling?

[00:16:24] Natasha Halliday: So, most of the time, if people can’t afford private counseling, they would have to look to community organizations, which can often mean a significant waitlist. There are some places that will do some therapists who will do, you know, maybe one or two pro bono, clients I’m really trying to expand my network of therapists so I can tap in and find out who’s doing what, and say, okay, this person might be able to do that.

The good thing about having worked in hospitals and communities before is I have a decent knowledge of what’s out there. Depending on how much interventions needed, maybe starting with a parent’s workplaces employment assistance program. They will respond quickly, but they respond quickly because they’re designed for brief contact. So, they might do four to six visits. If it’s, something that chances are we’ll need something longer, sometimes I recommend, well, can they do that until they get into something else that might have a waitlist. And looking at how we access the services that don’t require fees or some therapists have sliding scales.

So maybe they’re not charged, but they will charge less based on income based on whatever circumstance. And so, usually what I do is I kind of, if somebody reaches out to me and I’m not in a position to maybe reduce my fee or something like that, I say, let me contact my network. And again, touch with people because I know sometimes by the time you reach out, it feels like it took all your strength to do that, to hear no.

And feeling like you have to start from scratch is, might be the difference between continuing to pursue services and not. So, I try to help people with that in order to access or let them know there’s this community service available. There’s this one available? Sometimes it could be based on religion.

So, there are, organizations based on if you’re Catholic and organizations based on if you’re Jewish. If there’s someone who’s indigenous there are services specific to the indigenous community. And a lot of people just don’t know what’s out there because until they’ve had to access it, why would they know?

Right. I have to know because that’s been, my career is to be aware of what’s going on out there. So part of it is just helping people see, yes, there are options. The hard thing is when there’s a waitlist, because in that wait time readiness may change. The desire to participate may change, or potentially the mood on the issues may, may get worse.

 But looking at what can be done in the meantime can be all part of how we plan for supporting somebody, a young person.

[00:18:47] Suzanne F. Stevens: Now do you just provide one-on-one counseling or do you do any group therapy or any other methods?

[00:18:53] Natasha Halliday: I do individual right now. I would like to do a group. What I want to do is I want to apply for funding so that I can provide the group for free.

 I’ve just started looking at what some of the funding sources might be to see if I can put a proposal in to see how can I do that? Because again, You know, not everybody can access things when it’s a fee for service and we’re, at hopefully at the end of the pandemic and we know it’s hit people financially and there’s other things going on in the world that’s affecting us financially because things are becoming more expensive.

And so, as, as somebody who’s in practice, I also want to be creative about how I can offer services to make them more accessible. Because sometimes the people who need these services the most, might have the most trouble accessing them. And how do we make what we do as therapists more accessible to the community?

[00:19:41] Suzanne F. Stevens: Yeah, absolutely. And that would be great to be able to access funding for that. Because a lot of times people think, well, just offer it. There’s always a sustainability part to our businesses that in order to, continue contributing in meaningful ways, there’s gotta be a Ying and a Yang so that, that you can continue doing that, which I’m a huge advocate of.

So I hope you do find grants or a sponsor for that matter who maybe would want to support youth would be also great. So if anybody’s listening to this and wants to sponsor Natasha and youth, it would be a great investment for mental health. So, there’s your advertisement and Natasha.

[00:20:25] Natasha Halliday: And I’m very fortunate. A previous colleague of mine has actually just secured some funding.

Now I won’t be running the group. I’m, she’s going to hire me to help develop this specific group. So it’s really good to be involved in something that’s going to be targeted at youth as well. So I’m really excited to do that. Great.

[00:20:42] Suzanne F. Stevens: It’s a very demanding job that you have and contributed to children than adults’ mental health is I would imagine all consuming, but do you support any other causes or support causes that support them?

[00:20:56] Natasha Halliday: So right now, I’m on a steering committee for something called Pathways To Care and it’s, Something that was developed to look at access to care for black youth access to mental health care.

So I’ve been on that steering committee for about three years. I was volunteering and I took a quick break just because I was needing to create some more balance in my life. But in my field of study, I was, on the legislation board. To look at, we’re not a regulated field, so I’m registered as a social worker, but my field of study is not a regulated body.

So I was part of looking at how to get them regulated. So I usually find that I’m involved in a lot of causes. And then every once in a while, I’m like, okay, this is too much because one thing I’ve had I’ve become aware of is I’m so passionate about supporting. I’ve just gotta be cautious about building somebody else’s dream more than I’m building mine.

In the last few years have scaled back in some of those regards in order to balance out how much I’m committing to my own stuff.

[00:21:53] Suzanne F. Stevens: What I found particularly interesting is you said you had to pull back and the reality just as a complete aside, but for our listeners, one of the things I’m a huge advocate for is not contributing all over the place.

For many reasons. One sustainability is one of them. And like you said, you know, you’re contributing, but you can’t contribute everywhere. I and I talk about your compassion- connection, connect to what you care about and contribute there. Because we do, we get pulled here. Everyone wants a piece of us, right?

And that’s really difficult to sustain. So, kudos to you for pulling back on some of the things and saying, okay, this is what I want to need to focus on because the reality is if we focus all over the place, we have no impact. If we focus, we have a huge impact. And that’s one of the things I’m trying to get people that I work with to bring them in you don’t, you know, bring it in.

Because it does get, very difficult to handle.

I’ve had the honor of hearing you speak on a panel before. Do you perceive yourself as an advocate in any way, be it for youth, for women, for black women, for anyone? How do you perceive yourself?

[00:23:11] Natasha Halliday: I feel like the advocates by default. It’s not necessarily the goal, but it’s also something that I don’t think I can avoid doing.

So, in my speaking, my main target is mental health and resilience initially. As a black female, I cannot avoid speaking about anti-black racism. Anti-oppression I mean, technically I have the option to not, but I just feel so led to address some of these issues as somebody who’s worked in acute mental health for so many years.

One of the things that I like to do is look at how do we decrease stigma, right? And understanding how we can pathologize what we don’t know. So if it looks different, we might make it a symptom of illness, but how can we get to know somebody, their culture, and their spirituality better so that we can intertwine that in the understanding of how they present and maybe not just go, well, I’ve never heard of this, so it must be part of their, mental health presentation.

So, these are things that probably weren’t my initial goals. But I can’t sit quiet about it, so I often find myself speaking up and addressing it. Because again, my goal is to help people. And part of helping people is understanding, where some of these issues lie that can create barriers that can create things that impede, offering the best help that we can.

So what I’ve seen, I, I try to bring to the forefront to help increase people’s understanding is my understanding increases.

[00:24:35] Suzanne F. Stevens: Now has that ever backfired?

[00:24:38] Natasha Halliday: So far, I don’t think so. I think the one thing that happened, and it was probably because I was already outspoken, but my understanding is this happened almost everywhere.  In 2020, the pandemic hit, the George Floyd situation happened, and it raised awareness of understanding that we need to address anti-blackness. And the unfortunate default for many companies was then asked the black staff. But being black doesn’t by default mean you’re the best person to educate? What if I was sitting in a rage?

And I had not been in a healthy place. I could bring poison to what is supposed to be bringing healing. Now, fortunately for me, that wasn’t my position. We started something in the place that I was working at. And I started speaking on different panels and whatnot. I would hear from a lot of people, they were being asked.

And it’s like, no, no, no. First of all, you’re asking, you’re not wanting to pay you haven’t checked if they have the expertise, you would never bring in for other topics. He would never bring in somebody just because. And so, it’s that understanding of, we can’t take shortcuts to address real issues. It’s not that racism is new. We all know that it’s not that it was even necessarily happening more. The world shut down, so we had the opportunity to watch it more. Right? And so, in the face of that, instead of understanding what are your staff experiencing? Those who live in black bodies. It was, hey, let’s put more pressure on you to help fix the issue that systemic racism has created, but you fix it well.

No. How about it’d be a team effort and not putting more pressure on the same people who are being subjected to it to figure out the solution. And so that is something that I was very happy to speak up about because it was just so incredibly unfair and misguided. And I understand sometimes why it happens because it’s like, well, you understand, because you experience it.

But my experiencing it does not necessarily make me an expert in addressing it.

[00:26:39] Suzanne F. Stevens: And I think that’s such wise words, and I heard that happening often. So thank you for sharing your perspective on that.

Now, what advice would you give when working with youth?

[00:26:50] Natasha Halliday: Youth are the best BS detectors. So be yourself. Like they really are like I, I worked with youth for so long. And so one of the things they love about me is I like, look, I’m happily out of touch. I said I don’t wanna know the latest rap song. I don’t want to know the latest dance, but when, but I will say to them, you know, tell me a little bit because I want to be able to dialogue, but I don’t come pretending like.

In my forties, I still speak some slang, but I’m not going to come. Yo, yo, yo, and try to act like I’m their age. Uh, because one, as I’m doing it, my body will tell on me because something will crack and give evidence that I’m older than they are. But they, you can’t build relationships and build trust when you’re trying to falsify that interaction.

So you have to be true about where you’re at. It’s okay to say, “I don’t get that.” We live in a completely different world. I wasn’t raised with social media. I wasn’t raised with having a computer in your home. There are so many things that were not a part of my daily experience as a young person. So I don’t know what it’s like. Why am I going to pretend that I do.

 And they appreciate the authenticity because they would rather hear somebody say, yeah, I don’t know. Or yeah, that’s a bit off for me, then pretending to be something. And then they think that you’re just this big fake who is trying to win them over. It’s harder to trust that.

[00:28:13] Suzanne F. Stevens: Great advice.

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[00:28:50] Suzanne F. Stevens: We’ve talked a little bit about sustainability so far, and I just want to dive into that a little more. What are two, of the most biggest hurdles to sustaining your impact and how have you overcome them?

[00:29:04] Natasha Halliday: One was definitely myself in terms of what we talked about before in trying to spread yourself too thin.

So really understand that I can contribute in a more meaningful way when I’m present versus trying to split myself into too many directions. So that was definitely a part of my learning, how to really interact as an entrepreneur and support certain areas and understand where those areas are.

 And I think maybe another area is just moving with the trends. Because albeit, some things stay the same. There are other things that changed. So, when the pandemic hit, where I was working, I had already started working with one client virtually because of her job. And so, we were meeting on her lunch hour. But it still felt very uncomfortable.

And what we realized was it was as adults didn’t like functioning in that realm because it was newer to us. They are young people that we’re working with, I was working in a youth clinic, they were just like, okay, well I’m on FaceTime, I’m on this, I’m on that all the time. Now I’ll just do my therapy online. Like no big deal.

So, the discomfort was really in my own. And, my colleagues were facing the same thing. So it was like, okay, so I need to suck this up because I can still offer service. And it was trusting that you can be present. So just like how we’re doing this podcast, we can have a meaningful conversation and have as much coming up as we would in person. But I had to learn that, and I had to trust that. Because initially, I thought, how do I support somebody if I’m not physically present in the room? They can’t see my body language in the same way, because they’re only seeing a part of me, but then I had to be more, be more intentional.

What is my face saying? I have to make sure my face is saying, I’m here with you. I’m listening on present. Especially because of the pandemic, it really taught me something about as things shift how can I shift with them? Because if I’m resistant, I’m going to create barriers that don’t need to be there.

So I had to move past my own thinking and go, okay, this is what’s required right now. And this is how to do it. But that’s really been helpful for me as learning how to move with things as they move in order not to get stuck in creating barriers that don’t need to be there.

[00:31:19] Suzanne F. Stevens: You know, what’s interesting.

It just occurred to me when you were saying that. Many youths may use their phones for therapy, not a computer. And the reason I mentioned that is when you have a big computer or even in some cases, a laptop, you aren’t looking at the other person because you want them to think that you’re looking at them.

So, there can be a disconnect between eye contact and whom you’re actually looking at. And that’s been the biggest barrier. For me, as an interviewer is making sure you’re still there, but at the same time, looking forward, not at you. But when youth is using phone, it’s one of the same, cause it’s a smaller screen.

So, it just occurred to me that it would be very, fluid for younger people. Whereas for old-timers, I can’t believe I’m saying that, but my, point being is we’re often working off larger screens. So, there is more of a disconnect between who you’re looking at and what you’re seeing.

So it’s quite different now.

Far as your business, did it suffer all during the Pandemic?

[00:32:35] Natasha Halliday: So, I transitioned to full-time entrepreneurship in the fall. So, I actually want her 20, 21. So I was working full-time up until the end of September. And I was doing a bit of speaking, you know, doing some random comedy here and there. And I had my private practice on a small scale. And so, I looked at okay, how am I going to start building this?

I don’t think I fully got to assess how the pandemic would affect it. Because I work in mental health. A lot of people were seeking more mental support because of the pandemic. So we are probably one of the realms that business increased fairly consistently because people had more opportunity to recognize one, the pandemic was getting to them, but it was also, uh, when I can’t do some of the stuff that I didn’t realize it was part of my coping, cause it was part of my life and I’m how do I manage what I’m already struggling with? It kind of came more in the face of some people that yeah, I’m struggling. And so that also led to people seeking out therapy.

Right? The fact that we like predictability as human beings. We always have, we always, will. We can be spontaneous, but at the same token, we want some level of routine and predictability.

So, enter COVID and we’re constantly in uncertainty. That was very challenging for many people. And so that was part of recognizing, okay. I don’t know how to navigate this. And it keeps stretching out and it keeps changing and that was very distressing to some. So even that was part of why some people were like, okay, I need to get some support.

I can’t do this on my own.

[00:34:13] Suzanne F. Stevens: You’re in an emotional world and that can be very draining, I would imagine. And one of the things that you have done is streamline where you can contribute and where you can’t.

Is there anything that you do for yourself to make sure that you are always ready and present and deal with your mental health?

[00:34:35] Natasha Halliday: Yeah. So, I’m a firm believer that as a therapist, I need to have a practice to. Like, I can’t tell my clients, I try most of what I tell them, because I want to know, did it have any impact on me?

What do I think about breathing? What I think about grounding exercises, what I think about journaling? So, a lot of the techniques that I bring to my clients I’m either practicing or have at least tried. I’m very honest. We have to look at it like an accustomed made outfit.

Because you and I are different people. If we’re stressed out, what might distress you it may not be what I find releases the stress. And so, it’s tapping in, we have to check in with self what brings us back to that, that place that we want to be. Right? So, I’m fortunate. I live by the lake. I’m not out there in the dead of winter, but as soon as the weather permits, and permit by my standards. So, by what I’m comfortable with, I’m outside, I’m walking. I went for a hike yesterday for the first time in probably two and a half months. And I was just like, I was, it was like I was ready to hug a tree. Because it was like, I miss being in the woods. Like I miss, I miss being in nature.

So being in nature for me is very important. I’m a true human being. If I don’t get enough sleep and I don’t actually need a lot of sleep, I don’t, I pass seven hours. I’m probably sick. If I sleep that long, I don’t need a ton of sleep, but if I don’t give myself enough time to sleep, if I’m not paying attention to how I’m eating, all of these things become part of how I see that I am a slight that off and it can build it increment.

So, I try to pay attention to what I call my daily vitamin tactics. And I tell my clients about this. We often become reactive to the bigger moments, but I’m like just the way we take our vitamins to keep our health in a certain place. Why don’t we practice things daily to keep herself in that certain place?

Because a lot of the stress builds in a way we don’t see.. And then when it accumulates, we see it. But if we can also practice daily, offsetting that stress, we may not see to accumulate to that place where it overflows. Right now in journaling, getting back out into nature, meditation, prayer, all of that stuff is part of how I keep myself in a certain place.

I’m not consistent with it. But I try to where I can. Maybe two to three minute practice after every session so that I don’t feel that every new session I go into I’m carrying the weight of a previous session with a client in there, because there was a point when I was still working full time and I felt sleepy on my drive home.

And I started to assess. And what I realized was it was the weight of, if you have a date where you’re working with people who have all been severely traumatized and you’re ingesting that all day, if you’re not releasing in a way it affects you. And so, it’s recognizing that I can be of help to somebody, but I’m still taking in some of what’s happening in that interaction.

How do I release it? How do I offset it all the time so that it’s not weighing me down? So, I have a few different things that I often try to keep as part of my practice, but my big focus is on the regularity of practices is really key.

[00:37:40] Suzanne F. Stevens: What a ripple effect have you observed if any, with your patients?

[00:37:48] Natasha Halliday: So, one of the things that I think is so amazing is one, when they refer other people that speaks to how effective they feel that the therapy is and how safe. Because it’s one thing. You know for you to say, okay, I’m doing this, but now if I refer you to a friend, that friend is going to come back to me, if something goes wrong.

So really when my clients refer other people, I take that as tremendous feedback of this is going well. I feel safe with you. I feel that you’re really helpful. Some of the things that come out of the regular practice. The things my clients will want to consult me on and make a part of their interaction in the therapeutic practice. I think some of the greatest compliments are “I remembered you said something in dot, dot, dot,” or I thought of you when I was doing this.

And so, I did this and it’s just that understanding that they’re integrating what’s happening in session into their daily lives. And it’s having a positive impact.

[00:38:43] Suzanne F. Stevens: So why is your social impact important now?

[00:38:48] Natasha Halliday: Well, I think it’s always important to be able to help people and to remind people that there are people who will walk with you to be of help.

One of the reasons I think the relationships that I build with my clients are effective is because sometimes they don’t feel like they have anywhere else to go. So it’s that reminder that there is somebody who can be therewith, and walk with you during your time of need.

[00:39:12] Suzanne F. Stevens: How has your business provided meaning in your life or your role because your business is fairly new.

So, your role as a therapist, how’s it provided meaning in your life?

[00:39:25] Natasha Halliday: I think the biggest meeting is from knowing that I’m having positive impact and that comes from the feedback that I get from my clients. Um, and really something that. You know, a few times more recently as people having conversations with people, not realizing how things that I post on social media about what I’m doing, how it’s impacting others.

You know, one of my friends told me she was inspired to get her master’s degree and she’s like, it’s because of you. And I was like, whoa, like I had no idea. And she’s like, I saw you do it later in life. I see you doing this stuff. And you know, sometimes not haphazardly post, but we don’t necessarily think about what is this going to say to somebody else?

And so, the art has been something that I’ve really appreciated is those random moments where somebody is like, oh my goodness, I saw you posted this. And it, it had this impact on me and it was a positive impact.

[00:40:14] Suzanne F. Stevens: And I love that you continued your learning. I know a few people that have done that, and I find that very inspiring. Inspiring to do. And I respect it. I won’t do it. I’m taking a ton of courses right now, but I’m not going to get MBA, but I do respect it a ton.

So, what is one thing you wish you knew prior to becoming a therapist?

[00:40:39] Natasha Halliday: I wish I knew that you can be a therapist and still have issues. Sometimes a therapist has tremendous pressure on themselves to not have emotional concerns. But we’re human beings too. And one thing that I thought was beautiful, acceptance and commitment therapy is one of the modalities that I’ve studied in, in the book, the author, one of the books, the author said, see it, like, you’re both on a mountain.

You might be higher on your mountain because you’ve learned certain things which gives you a vantage point to help them. But it doesn’t mean you’re not still facing things on your mountain. And I love that because I would get upset with myself sometimes for struggling with something. Being a therapist does not remove me from being human.

And as I learn how to deal with the things that come my way, I can also bring that learning to my practice. So, it enriches me as a therapist. It doesn’t make me worse. But I wish I had understood that before. A little after.

[00:41:34] Suzanne F. Stevens: What have you done that’s made you uncomfortable, but if you didn’t do it, you would not have had the impact on the beneficiary, your patients.

[00:41:46] Natasha Halliday: One starting my private practice. I had the most reasons why I shouldn’t. I think I want to do it for about two years and avoided it.

[00:41:53] Suzanne F. Stevens: That’s a big one.

[00:41:54] Natasha Halliday: Yeah. The start was getting past that hurdle of all the reasons that come up in your mind. And then part of what I think I’ve learned too is, you know, we learned about appropriate self-disclosure as therapists and it’s about how can I show you that I’m human too, in a way that’s going to help you?

And initially again with the idea that I shouldn’t have issues. I think I struggled with that. And now I can say, yeah, like I’m one of those people whom some days is looking for their cell phone and realize this is in their hand or looking for their glasses and realize it’s on my head. Like I have those human moments too, and we can laugh about it and it can level the playing field so that it doesn’t feel like, you know, I see myself as this superior entity. I’m a human being who’s learning things too, and, and has things to heal from. And I just help glad that I can help you in your healing journey, but it doesn’t exempt me from having issues. And it doesn’t exempt me from suffering.

And I don’t think I’m superior. I just think we’re all human beings and I’m just happy that I can help some other human beings just like I seek help for different things.

[00:43:03] Suzanne F. Stevens: So, the worst piece of advice you ever received.

[00:43:07] Natasha Halliday: Don’t continue my schooling.

[00:43:10] Suzanne F. Stevens: The best piece of advice you’ve ever received.

[00:43:12] Natasha Halliday: Do it even though you’re scared.

[00:43:15] Suzanne F. Stevens: Which of your strengths do you rely on most to have the success you have achieved?

[00:43:20] Natasha Halliday: Tenacity, I keep going.

[00:43:22] Suzanne F. Stevens: Beside yours, which beneficiary do you think needs the most investment of time research and money?

[00:43:30] Natasha Halliday: I don’t know if I can narrow that down. I would just say, communities where there are disadvantages.

[00:43:35] Suzanne F. Stevens: What leadership advice do you have for people who want to have a social impact?

[00:43:39] Natasha Halliday: Have somebody in your circle who’s ahead of you so you can see how it’s done.

What advice would you give now? I don’t know if you have any children and it doesn’t matter, but if you had a 10-year-old daughter today, what advice would you give to her?

It’s okay. To mess up. We’re all going to do it.

[00:43:57] Suzanne F. Stevens: What advice do you wish you received?

Probably the same advice.

Who’s the greatest female influence in your life?

[00:44:03] Natasha Halliday: Probably my mother.

[00:44:06] Suzanne F. Stevens: What three values do you live by?

[00:44:08] Natasha Halliday: Authenticity.

Integrity. And I would say probably again, the tenacity keep trying.

[00:44:15] Suzanne F. Stevens: Those three I highlight, in one of my talks because women that have a social impact have a tendency to lean to those three and then a few others. So there you go. I knew I was supposed to get together and thank you Natasha and thank you for all of you for joining us, you can subscribe to YouMeWe Amplified podcasts. So, you receive each new interview notification in your inbox. Please share this interview by going to the share button located on Natasha’s page. The interview can be consumed your way so you can read it. Watch it or listen. And if you do want to grow your social impact, join the You, Me We community women, leading social impact.

Visit we@YouMeWe.ca for this exclusive group of women, transforming organizations and communities through conscious leadership and social impact. And the last question of course goes to our guests. Do you have any words of wisdom for our audience regarding making a contribution to society?

[00:45:19] Natasha Halliday: Trust that you are making a contribution. Because there are so many ways that I’ve learned in hindsight, that something I did had a positive impact that I had no idea.

[00:45:31] Suzanne F. Stevens: Excellent. Well, until next time, make your contribution count for You. Me. We.